Jaclyn (00:01.335)

So welcome Brent and thanks for joining me today.

Brent Fikowski (00:03.906)

Yeah, good to be here. Thank you so much.

Jaclyn (00:05.933)

So before we dive into too much meat, I'm really hoping you can orient our listeners to a little bit more about your really impressive background. Because you started as a pro athlete in volleyball, right?

Brent Fikowski (00:16.152)

Definitely not pro in volleyball. Competitive, but certainly not pro. Yeah. Nowhere near being, you know, getting paid or being an Olympian. I played at college. So, you know, I had a, I was successful in high school. We won our provincial championship when I was in high school, which was a lot of fun. And then I played two years in college volleyball. So I had a scholarship and mostly sat on the bench. So I'm not going to over-exaggerate my accomplishments in volleyball too much. and was a competitive swimmer.

Jaclyn (00:17.964)

Okay.

Brent Fikowski (00:43.791)

in high school as well. you know, sort of thought my athletic career was, was mostly finished. I career defines getting paid. I athletic journey, I thought was mostly finished, but, you know, like a lot of people did, you know, stumbled into a CrossFit gym to get a little better for volleyball. I still playing some beach volleyball for fun. And yeah, this was when I was, let's see, 21 and that would have been in 2012 and found myself really enjoying it. I had an act for it, went to some like kind of small competitions, just for fun. And here we are, you know, it's been, you know, it's 2012. So now it's 2024. It's been 12 years, over 12 years doing this. And now it's my, you know, full time source of income. And I travel around the world. I finished as high as second in the world and sort of been at the, been at the top, been in the top range of men now for nine years in a row. Yeah.

Jaclyn (01:34.317)

That's amazing and that's impressive to stay at the top. Sometimes people think it's tough to get there, but I think actually staying there has equal challenges, if not more.

Brent Fikowski (01:43.668)

Yeah, I mean the athlete I was when I first came in and it's so different to who I am now. the sport, any young, any sport really has changed a lot in the last 10 years, but certainly a young sport like ours has changed a lot. then just, you know, sometimes I talk to athletes and try to give them some advice. And I say, you know, a lot of times whatever gets you from, you know, A to B, is not going to get you from B to C, whether that's, you know, your mentality or your training routine, or maybe your coaches or whatever that is. Like you have to be willing to consistently like sharpen the saw and just keep learning and keep being willing to like adapt and just change, you know, who you are and how you do things. And so yeah, the, yeah, it's, interesting looking back at old training logs or old journal entries and stuff from 2012, 2016, even, and it's just changed so much my relationship with, the sport. So.

Jaclyn (02:38.411)

love that because that advice is applicable really across the board because no matter what kind of area of your life you're looking at you're gonna hit some kind of plateau right you have to always be willing to grow and analyze and try new things so it's great advice for athletes and beyond for sure. Tell me a little bit about what connect what did you connect to in CrossFit that made you just fall in love with that sport and and I'd also love to know more about how CrossFit's kind of changed you and impacted your lifestyle and your overall health.

Brent Fikowski (03:05.686)

Yeah, I think, you know, think what drew it, what I was drawn to was the competitive nature of it. Like I like to compete and you know, there's just so much to work on, right? It never gets boring. And so I used to swim and there's only four strokes, right? And there's basically three turns and there's two dives and that's kind of it. And you're, mastering those things and there's a constant level of mastery that, you know, will never end. But, you know, with, with this sport, with, you know, functional fitness crossfit, there's just so many movements to continually master and so many different combinations. And every time you go to a competition, the events change, right? So, you know, you'll have a long event, a short event, heavy, different, different movements. They'll add in new movements you've never done before. And I think that level of variety was, was really exciting for me and just constantly learning new things was really cool. And I think sometimes what people are drawn to, I've heard this expression. Grit is fit, which means like you will, you know, people say, you you gotta be gritty. You gotta be industrious. You gotta work really hard. You gotta be disciplined. That's a lot easier when something, suits you. Right. And so when you're naturally inclined, like, this kind of comes easy for me or this I'm really, you know, I'm, I'm seeing progress very quickly. And I think that's sort of what I found there where I look back and when I played, I played a bit of basketball in high school.

And it wasn't a good fit for me. Like I'm pretty tall, but there was just something about the game that volleyball was a much better fit for me. And so I could have been, it would have been really challenging for me to have a really high level of dedication to a sport like basketball when it wasn't really a good fit for me physically and mentally. what was the second question?

Jaclyn (04:48.589)

Well, really about – because with CrossFit, obviously, you've well, you've always been athletic, but how has CrossFit caused you to kind of impact your lifestyle, your overall health? I know it's such an intense form of exercise that it requires a lot of discipline and rest and self-care and awareness. I'd love to know how – because I think there's so many people who get injured when they go too hard too soon.

Brent Fikowski (05:13.302)

Yeah, I've been fortunate. well, mean, fortunate might be one word, but I think I've only ever pulled out of one competition due to an injury and that was in 2015. So I look after my body. take a lot of pride in that. take a lot of pride in the fact that when I say I'm going to show up to a competition, I do that. And, know, sometimes I've shown up to a competition, maybe not a hundred percent, but I take, you know, I take my nutrition seriously. I take my rest seriously. I'm just kind of always listening to the, I think it's a bit of a, bit of an expression maybe not everyone's used to, but like the whispers in my body. So, you know, if I'm feeling like, my Achilles is a little tight, like I'll, you know, massage my calf or I'll stretch or I'll go see a professional, whether that's like a sports chiropractor or massage therapist, like I really keep on top of those things. I don't let them fester and hope they go away and just keep running or just keep doing, you know, doing more lifting and more jumping until that little, you know, tightness in my Achilles turns into a really big problem that then takes months or, you know, years or something to fix.

So I do a really good job of that and staying very patient. And when someone tells me, you know, what to do, if that's a sports chiropractor, like I do those exercises. I don't just go in and say, yeah, yeah, sure. And then come back two weeks later and say, nothing feels better. And why is that? I'm like, well, I didn't do anything. You told me, pride myself in moving really well. And yeah, I think, you know, through, through this training, like, obviously I'm a competitor, but, you know, CrossFit as a whole, it's so it's intertwined with the nutrition and the lifestyle aspect, right? And when you train hard and you train in all these different disciplines and you add in really good nutrition and eating really clean and just eating quality food and trying to get good rest, I definitely feel like I'm in really good shape and I'm very healthy, right? I'm healthier than most people my age. I think, granted, if I was to train a little bit less, I would probably be more healthy because sometimes performance and know like high level elite performance isn't always exactly correlated with like high level health but if i train just a little bit less a little bit less intense i would yeah feel like i could you know i'd be like as healthy as i could be for my age

Jaclyn (07:26.825)

It's such an interesting thing that you bring that up because I think that you are when you're pushing the boundaries of your body as a professional athlete, really across any sport, it's like how much can I get out of this body before it breaks or before I can't keep doing this anymore? And it feels like that's such a fine line to walk and to know. I love that you described the whispers because that's something that we all talk about with our patients all the time is like, if you don't listen to the whispers, they become, talking level voices and then they become screams, right? So that seems like a really good strategy, but you know, the longevity in a sport, when you look at athletes who perform at a high level for such a long time, there's just like, there's just certain behaviors that have to come into play. And I think about the people that I know that have been in professional roles that long, and it is a lot of it, the things that you talk about, it's not just workouts, but it's nutrition and it's rest and it's overall care. let's start, you bring up nutrition,

Brent Fikowski (07:57.517)

Yeah.

Jaclyn (08:25.045)

Tell me a little bit about your nutrition more generally and how you got to that point where it feels optimized for you and why is it so important for recovery?

Brent Fikowski (08:35.694)

Yeah, I think it's really important for recovery. I think, you know, people can, you know, I had a friend message me about, you know, he's like, I think I might get a sauna, right? Like, what do you think? And I said, yeah, like if you use it all the time, you're going to see benefits from it. think I sent him, you know, a link from, like Dr. Rhonda Patrick. She's a bit of an expert on some cold plunges. She has this great website and you know, heat stuff. I said, if you like anything, if you do it regularly, you're going to see results, but it's a lot like food. If you just, if you have a salad once a month.

Right? It's not really gonna, it's not really gonna move the needle as far. And it's sort of the same with, you know, you can read about, you most people by now know like sleep is important and put down your phone before bed and maybe have a dark room and a cold room. Like most people, not everyone, but I'm sure a lot of people listening to this podcast are aware of those things, but how many people actually do those things and do them regularly. And so when it comes to food, you know, I don't do anything that's really,

Jaclyn (09:05.601)

That's not enough? Just kidding.

Brent Fikowski (09:29.998)

gonna blow anyone's mind. I was into organ meats before it was a thing. Like I feel like the last two years, it's kind of one of the new hot items. But you know, I was having organ meat like heart and some liver up till I think I started eating those in 2015 or 16, just because it was cheaper at the time. Now it's not. But it was cheaper. And so I was able to get you know, high-quality meat. really, you know, for me, like a normal breakfast looks like eggs, vegetables, really big bowl of oats. have to have a lot of carbs. So the amount of carbs I consume, I'm six foot two, I'm 222 pounds and I train twice a day, six days a week. So there's a lot of fuel that needs to go in and a lot of that's carbs. But yeah, so in the morning eggs, know, vegetables, maybe a bit of fruit, a lot of oats. And then I basically have two full lunches, right? And those look like, you know, either sweet potato or rice, a lot of meat and vegetables. Sometimes one of those meals is a smoothie, which would be fruit, some protein powder, oats. And then dinner looks a lot like lunch, which is either sweet potato rice and meat, know, sometimes red meat, sometimes chicken, sometimes pork, ideally fish. Probably don't, I'd like to have more fish in my diet. It's just expensive. And then, yeah, before bed also, you know, usually another snack, sometimes casein protein or bone broth or both. And then sometimes more oats. So pretty like simple, right? Fruit, vegetables, nuts.

Meat and yeah, not a lot of dairy some dairy But I find if I have too much like I'll have whey protein and that doesn't seem to bother me in casein but if I have a lot of you know cheese or yogurt I find my sinuses just get a bit stuffed up and then Kind of the same with gluten. I just kind of avoid it. I find if I have a lot I just like feel like my hands are a bit puffier and stuff And I'll notice like, you know when you talk about recovery You know if I ever have you know a couple weeks ago when I

Jaclyn (11:09.558)

Hmm.

Brent Fikowski (11:24.972)

One of my patella's was just like a bit hot, my tendon, right? And I kind of realized, I said to my wife, was like, you know what? I haven't been eating as well. Like just kind of, you know, I'd go run an errand and then I'd stop into some grocery store and buy a snack. And, know, I was just, you know, buying more chocolate from the grocery store, just some snacks that I like, cause it's kind of the off season. And then I realized as I picked up my training that, you know, my, my one shoulder was a bit. Sore and my patella was inflamed and I was like, Claire, I got a buckle down here. So I really like got back to kind of the whole 30, you know, very strict, really the only, you know, unhealthy thing I had in a day was dark chocolate. within two weeks, that kind of inflammation just went away. And those, it wasn't anything I changed in my training. wasn't stretching anymore. I wasn't warming up any more or less. My technique didn't change. And it was just, just that inflammation from, you know, deciding making that making that hard choice, but that obvious choice to just eat a little bit healthier. And instead of like 70 30, it was more like 95 five as far as percentage of, you know, specifically healthy foods. So yeah.

Jaclyn (12:29.165)

I mean, it's amazing, but that can make or break a difference because our food, like you said, it's fuel, but it's not just fuel. It's also information to our body. know, that what we put in can trigger inflammation or cytokines. And I love that you bring that up and that you notice that because for a lot of people, when you can become aware of that, it becomes so empowering. You know, as an ND, we talk about this all the time. But when it comes to food guidelines or guidance that we might give to a patient,

Brent Fikowski (12:37.261)

Yeah.

Jaclyn (12:57.687)

For me, it's never about you can never eat X, Y, Z. It's about helping that person connect when I eat X, Y, Z, this is how I feel as a result. And then it becomes a choice. And you're not some random victim, but you're like an active accomplice in the process, right? So it's great when you can start to tailor that. I love that you can feel that, the difference that good nutrition makes for you.

Brent Fikowski (13:20.298)

Yeah, I think that's a really, it's interesting, right? it's, when you make that realization, it becomes, you know, empowering, but also, you know, to the wrong person, it's like, you know, it could feel like guilt all the time when you really, know, when you, and that's the thing, I think a lot of there's, certainly some people that have never really had like regular sleep, you know, some reduction in stress, regular exercise and like healthy food for, know, whether that's 30 days or 60 days and they, they,

Jaclyn (13:47.693)

Mm-hmm.

Brent Fikowski (13:49.772)

get to a point where it's like, you know, let's say no caffeine and they're like, wow, so this is what like baseline feels like. This is what good feels like, or, you eight out of 10. and then if you start, you know, having alcohol and increasing your stress and not exercising and, you know, having really bad sleep habits where you're not sleeping enough and you add all those things, you're like, wow, I was living like that before and thought that was essentially normal or baseline. and that's, you know, it's something I take for granted, but I've probably had, you know, five drinks in the last year, you know,

I just don't really drink. It's really just not part of my, you know, the people I hang out with or the habits I have. It's not like I have some hard and fast rule. Like I had a, you know, bachelor party a couple of years ago and, you know, drank enough for four years basically that weekend with friends and, you know, we had a good time. then, so I don't have like some hard and fast rule, but I just, it just doesn't really fit into my lifestyle. And I imagine I'm like, man, if I had...

Jaclyn (14:26.433)

Mm-hmm.

Jaclyn (14:34.551)

haha

Brent Fikowski (14:45.986)

couple drinks every week or one every night, you know, how much would that add up and, know, impact my performance, but also just, know, how I feel and, you know, even levels on, on a Dutch test, right? Like, you know, how much would that affect my whatever testosterone or anything else, right?

Jaclyn (14:56.609)

Mm-hmm.

Jaclyn (15:00.927)

Right, yeah definitely. So beyond nutrition, what are the other lifestyle areas that you think you need to really pay attention to for optimal performance? You've mentioned rest and sleep.

Brent Fikowski (15:11.554)

Yeah, think nutrition for sure. You know, it's funny, someone mentioned to me once, they were saying that, you know, they're hunting or whatever and they, shoot a brown bear or black bear and they eat a lot of blueberries. They're like, their fat is actually like blue. And it's when you really think of it that way, it's just like an interesting, it's like, you you are what you're eat and that is the fuel that's literally like comprising like what you are. Right. And so if you're eating high-quality food or low-quality food like the actual composition of your body, you know will will change but Yeah rest for sure. You know, I with my schedule I'm able to I don't nap every day, but I'm able to nap You know a couple times a week when I need to which definitely helps. I have some But certainly some hard yesterday. I had some really hard training and having that even just it was a 20-minute nap yesterday I think made that second session a lot more tolerable. So that's pretty good and then I'm fortunate I have I have a daughter she's two and a half but she sleeps very well she sleeps like through the night 11 12 hours every night so that means my wife and I are able to get you know kind of at minimum eight and a half but you know upwards sometimes closer to 10 which is pretty pretty big yeah yeah yeah it's definitely hard when we put her down and you're you know you're kind of doing the math you're like okay we have to get the bed here and you know an hour an hour and a half if we want to have a proper sleep and so you know

Jaclyn (16:23.565)

That's With a toddler, that's record setting. That's fabulous.

Brent Fikowski (16:36.93)

But you know, we're willing to do that and then it makes, you know, the days aren't as long, but the quality of those days definitely improve. Sleep, that's really important. For me, you know, exercise is training is my job. So I certainly have a different relationship to, to the training and exercise than like an average person where it might feel like a, an obligation or something that's sort of like taking away. And for me, it's a it's like a non-negotiable. It's like going to work, right? But that being said, you know, I train alone. I train in my backyard. I have a coach that's online that, you know, I speak to daily, but you know, I could lie and say I went and trained. never, I never lie, but I could. And so it is, you know, I, it's important as it is for me to train. I would say almost every training session, there's always that voice that says, you don't really have to. So even myself who's this is what I do. I still have that voice of like, I really don't want to like, I'd rather just sit on the couch and relax and maybe just go and you know, so there's still that voice, right? And it's just the dedication and the devotion to saying, you know, it's more important and I'm going to feel better if I do it.

Jaclyn (17:51.757)

That's fascinating to hear because I think that's probably going be unexpected to a lot of people that are listening. And I think it's really humbling also to hear that because everyone starts any kind of program with a high level of motivation, but then everybody hits that point where they're no longer motivated. And then you have to kind of count on discipline to get you through because the motivation's not there. I've always perceived that know, more professional athletes like really don't experience that same thing. So it's reassuring that you have. How have you gotten through that? Like those times, those days that tell you that while you're staying in your supplement, I really need to show up or I can do a, you know, I don't know if I'm allowed to say this on the, our podcast, but like a half ass workout, you know, not really giving it your all, going through the motions, but not really doing it. How do you get yourself to do what you know you.

Brent Fikowski (18:38.958)

You

Jaclyn (18:47.723)

that helps you achieve your long-term goals on those days where that motivation's not there.

Brent Fikowski (18:52.236)

Yeah, I think within your question, most of the answers are there. so, interestingly, you know, the difference between motivation, you know, dedication, and even someone brought up this word to me recently, Joshua Medcalf, he was saying, devotion. And so I'm devoted to my long-term goals and I've made a commitment to my coach. I know for a lot of people that helps is having some sort of something externally, the third party that you are accountable towards sometimes that's paying a coach and then it's like, okay, like I have made the commitment. paid this money. I heard, once of, you know, this is something I read. So I don't know the truth of it, but these, you these men made this commitment and they said, okay, if, if we don't reach this, you know, whichever, whichever of us don't reach this, we have to make a contribution to this charitable organization, which was not a charitable organization that they actually believed in. Like it was a controversial one. I won't say the name of it. But you know, that was to them, that was this external, you know, dedication, like, hey, you know, if I don't do this, this is my my punishment almost so carrot or the stick punishment or reward. But for me, it's like it's a devotion. It's a it's a commitment. Certainly not motivation. Motivation wanes, right? Motivation is a lot like joy or happiness, right? And I mean, if someone asked me yesterday, like, you know, do you feel joy today? Like, no. you know, I, I this really painful, I had these sprints on the eco bike in the morning, which were really tiring. I had, you know, three or four hours of calls throughout the day. And then in the afternoon it was four o'clock and I had these like really challenging intervals of, you know, like burpees and rower sprints and pull-ups. And it was like, I'm like, I don't want to do this. I am tired. I don't want to do this at all.

and I contemplated like, maybe I could, you know, move a training session from, you know, the next day into this day. And then I could do it tomorrow. I'm like, Frank, you're just avoiding the inevitable. Like it has to get done. And sometimes what you kind of said, like rolling through the motions is totally okay. I think that's something like not every session is going to be magical. I've even heard this Olympian say this thing called the rule of thirds, where, know, a third of your training should be great. A third of your training should be like pretty good.

Brent Fikowski (21:15.586)

You know, and then a third is like not so good. And if you're kind of hitting those ranges, at least from a performance perspective, you're probably on the right track. Cause if every session is great, you're probably not training is for performance. At least if every session is great, you're probably not training hard enough or frequently enough to elicit. Like a really good response, unless you're, mean, it's possible that every training session is great. I mean, it's never happened to me. and certainly no one I've ever talked to that's competing at my level, even if Instagram shows you otherwise, it's certainly not the case for anyone in my sport. And then, you know, some sessions are like, that was pretty good. That was solid. And then, you know, a third of the sessions are just, you're just getting it in. You're just putting in the work. And sometimes, you know, I'll start a, I'll start a training session and I'm like, Hey, I'm just going to get done. What's on the page that my coach sent me. I'm not going to break any records. I'm not, know, instead of pushing it, you know, a hundred percent, I'm going to push it, you know, 80, 80, 90%. And then maybe

Jaclyn (21:49.249)

You don't post the bad workouts,

Brent Fikowski (22:13.09)

A lot of times you warm up, you get going. And as you get into it, you're able to kind of build some momentum and you go, wow, that actually was a good. sometimes even sometimes those turn into great sessions. I think it's sometimes the surprise where, but you know, I always go in and I always warm up. And then if after the warmup and after the first, know, let's say have four, like four weight sets or something like that. So 20 working sets after the first few sets of that for first, exercise, if I'm still like completely out of it mentally. I might pull the plug that happens like once every six months. You know, one time I was sick and I went in and I did the first thing and I puked and then I was like, well, that's just because I wasn't it wasn't from the exercise. I was just actually sick. So I said, OK, that's enough. And then sometimes I'm just so mentally, you know, distraught and stressed from other factors like life factors that I just can't I just can't pull myself together to will myself to do it. But I but nine.

Jaclyn (22:57.527)

Mm-hmm.

Brent Fikowski (23:11.47)

more than nine times out of 10, know, like, it's really less than 1 % of the time where I'll go in, I'll warm up, I'll get started. And most of the time it's like, you know what, I can get through this. so yeah, it's just that like, you know, don't set the goal of running five miles a day, set the goal of putting on your running shoes and stepping out the door every day. You know, cause once you do that, it becomes easier.

Jaclyn (23:32.299)

Yeah, that's a great, you're right, that's the toughest part, that first step, just getting your shoes on. How you can best take care of your cellphone. Can you start by sharing a little bit about how did you come across the Dutch test? How do you use it to kind of, what information does it give you that helps you be a better athlete?

Brent Fikowski (26:47.072)

Yeah, I think the way I describe it is it kind of gives you a gives you a peek under the hood, right? And so, you know, you can, you know, can take vitamin D, like, you know, if you live in Canada, it's probably a pretty good idea. It's one of the cheapest supplements you can get. I'm not a dietitian nutritionist. So, you know, take that with a grain of salt. Yeah, yeah, what's, yeah, what's the, yeah, there's a there's some sort of disclaimer, I should say, this is not advice. This is just what anyway, but

Jaclyn (27:05.867)

I vouch for that statement though, it's okay. Doctor approved.

Brent Fikowski (27:16.972)

You know, and so it's one thing to do that. And there's an assumption that that should work and that is important. but it's another thing to, you know, get some testing done, right. And, know, to whether it's, you know, blood work from your doctor, which in Canada can be, you know, it's, still fine, but it's not, it's not as easy to get like comprehensive blood work in Canada. Cause in the States you can just pay to get exactly the blood work you want to get done. but you know, even, you know, for the Dutch test, right. obviously with the the high level of training I'm doing, know, checking my cortisol levels, right? Checking, you know, various different factors throughout the day. And then it's one thing to get that snapshot. And that's another thing to do that on a semi-regular basis and try to change a few things and see if in six months or in a year, you can see some improvements. And so, you know, I, forget, honestly, I forget, I think I had some practitioner recommended to me and you know, I did one, years ago was the first one I've done. And so it's cool to see, you know, an evolution, hopefully not a devolution over the last few years and just, you know, just to keep tabs, to keep tabs on that. And I'm curious to do one when I'm, when I'm no longer competing and seeing if the reduction of training stress from my life will make an impact on some of those levels as well.

Jaclyn (28:20.354)

Mm-hmm.

Jaclyn (28:35.309)

Are you open to sharing some of the things you've seen change over time? Like have you seen changes in cortisol over time?

Brent Fikowski (28:42.45)

I'm trying to think of something specific, you know, honestly, a lot of it is like, especially in Canada. I think it's the same in the States. It still has to go through a practitioner in the States. Is that correct? Yeah. Yeah. It does here in Canada. And so like a lot of it is, is putting trust in them. Right. And so, you know, I have here in Kelowna, Chelsea Gronic, like she's amazing. she's great. And then I have sort of a secondary person that'll, that looks at it. Who's just a friend and he's, he's helped with like some high level athletes.

Jaclyn (28:52.353)

Yes.

Jaclyn (28:57.261)

Hmm.

Brent Fikowski (29:10.786)

And so it's interesting, know, I have, you know, so she's going to give me some advice on that. And then I have to make sure that, none of those things are banned substances. Like that's like a specific thing she might want to do. Like, Hey, you know, we could do like, like IV, right. And just do like IV treatments. Cause that's something that a lot of her regular patients do. And I'm like, I can't do that. you know, I think it's over like a hundred milliliters. You can't just go and have an IV for vitamin C or vitamin D or iron or zinc. so I have to be aware of that. And then the other practitioner, you know, Mike Castelli, like he's more familiar with, like athletes competing at a high level. And so there's going to be some things like, you know, my, my testosterone is like actually pretty low and it's just because I'm training so much. And so he's more familiar with that where he's like, Hey, you know, if you just stopped training for like three to six months, he's like, I think it'd be fine. And he's asking some more like subjective questions around like, how's your energy levels, right? Like, you know, how's your, like your libido or how's training? you seeing progress in your lists? Like, are you feeling like you're just like losing energy? And there's sort of these more subjective things and, and he's just going to have more, you know, experience dealing with more athletes looking at similar panels and just being able to like compare those factors. so yeah, I think, and then as far as like actionable changes, you know, you know, I've tried some, like liquor, shoot extract, right. To just improve, to improve my cortisol in the morning, which, which actually has helped.

Jaclyn (30:33.197)

Mm-hmm.

Brent Fikowski (30:37.838)

over the past few months, I think that I've actually noticed a change. And then there was a window of time after a big competition here that I just stopped taking it. Cause I was just, just did, just did. Cause I was just traveling around and just wasn't thinking about it. And I was noticing that like, was getting kind of tired in the mornings and I felt like, you know, having that and getting a high-quality liquor, extract supplement, you know, made a difference. you know, in just my like energy levels in the morning. So that's like a, that's a specific example, the liquor, shoot extract of one that I can think of.

I'm trying to think if there's any other ones. That's the main one. Yeah.

Jaclyn (31:13.101)

That's great. And I love that you have someone who is more specialized and nuanced in their interpretation. Because I think when you're in any kind of biologically unique category, like professional athlete, something like seeing low testosterone on a test might be concerning for someone who doesn't see professional athletes all the time and know that that's a pattern that they would recognize. So it's great. And it just speaks to the need to really find a provider that understands you, understands your condition, understands the parameters that you're working with for your health. So I would put just a plug in for that because it's really great that you found a couple of people that you can really trust. And that's exactly what we want at the Dutch test is for people who utilize it to find someone to help them really interpret specifically for their own needs. That's fabulous. Have you noticed that there have been changes in your performance? When you've had different hormonal ups and downs, it's like core cells high, core cells low, things like that. Have you seen differences in the outcome?

Brent Fikowski (32:18.126)

I think usually it's hard to correlate a lot of that. There's, especially in our sport, there's just so many variables and the, the, competition has changed so much. think it'd be a lot easier if, the sport was more consistent where it was like, you know, just the a hundred meter dash, right. Or just, Hey, you're going to swim 400 meter freestyle and you can just track your progress over time and your kind of rate of perceived exertion and just, you know, you're just your times. Right. So it is hard.

You know, I'll have a great stretch of training where I'm feeling really good and I compete and I feel great. And then I don't place as well. And sometimes that's just, did my competitors get better than me or did the events change drastically? And then the inverse happens where, you know, there'll be some false flags on the positive side where it's like, wow, I did great at this competition, but it's like, well, maybe you only did well. Cause you kind of got a little bit lucky. maybe everyone else wasn't doing so well and the workouts were really good for you. And you know, some of your inadequacies were covered up in the perfect way. So it's honestly, it's really hard in this sport. There's a lot of, you know, internal kind of, you have to have like an internal compass as to your own progress. would say for me, you know, when it comes to things like the cortisol and stuff like that, a lot of it's just, stress, just life stress, stress from outside training, and then even my perception of things that are going on.

Right. I think, you know, for me, I find that, when I'm like really stressed and, you know, there was a period of time during this year where I was really busy and really emotional and really stressed and a lot of things were bringing me down and, know, I tried to add in training on top of that. was really, really challenging. And I'm sure that if I didn't do my Dutch chest then, but I'm sure if I did, it would not have been favorable. And there wasn't, I wasn't particularly eating poorly and there wasn't like a

Jaclyn (34:06.477)

Hmm.

Brent Fikowski (34:15.884)

like a pinpoint of some sort of physiological factor that I could point to other than it was my perception of what was going on that mentally, you know, made me just exhausted.

Jaclyn (34:27.159)

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. And I think you bring up such an interesting point, because I think that's unique to the group of professional level athletes, is there's a really unique mindset that I think it takes to push yourself to that level. how do you get yourself, how do you develop, I guess, that mindset muscle over time? Or what advice might you give someone to really, how can they change their mindset to start to be able to move themselves into optimal performance, whether that's physical or that some other area of their life professionally, family, personally.

Brent Fikowski (35:06.328)

Yeah, that's a good question. It's certainly something that I think I probably take for granted. And I think I've realized that really in the last two years where not to, without tooting my horn too much, I think that level of, let's call it high performance has become like a habit for myself. And so, you know, I look back to high school.

And, you know, I had really good grades. I think I was in the top five grades for 400 person graduating class. And, you know, I was a scholarship athlete and I was the president of the, whatever student council or something like that. So I was very busy and I was like, you know, playing guitar at shows. Like I was just really busy and I was everything I did. I think, I tried to be like all in and tried to just fully, you know, essentially high performance, right? Like I was just trying to be a high performer in every area of my life and just tried to do that as best I could. you know, now in this case, that's resulted in me being one of the best in the world in this like really niche little sport. whereas, you know, there's certainly other outlets where if I tried to be a high performer and, know, something else, it doesn't guarantee that I'm going to be, you know, the best in the world at, whatever it is that I might do after that. But.

I think just taking a lot of pride in, in whatever you're doing. And, you know, I think that's something that it's cause like, I think it's really trying to think of the right way to put this, but it's unlikely that if there's someone who's like a true high performer and really successful in one avenue of your, of their life, most of the time, those characteristics that have brought them there will show up in other areas of their life. So, for example, mental training or mental toughness isn't something like you switch on and off when you enter or exit the field of play at a competition. It's not something you can expect like, now that I'm on the basketball court and the whistle blows, now I'm going to be mentally tough and I'm going to be dedicated. Or now that I've entered the gym for one hour a day, I'm going to be, when training gets hard and there's that burn in your muscles, I'm going to push through that, I'm going to get more.

Brent Fikowski (37:31.374)

going to do more. And then you turn that off when you leave and you know, maybe you're, maybe you're at a job you don't like particularly love, but Hey, it pays the bills. It's like, well, how hard are you working at that job? Right. And are you still giving your best because you're the type of person that just gives their best even if you don't know, cause I've had retail jobs, I've had jobs that I, that weren't going anywhere, but they paid the bills. and I still just did my best cause that's you know, I take pride in that, like on a personal level and not because anyone else tells me to, and not because I'm like, you know, looking for a raise or a performance bump or whatever that is. It's just like, that's just the kind of person that I want to be. and I pride myself in that. And so I think that that's, know, it's a choice and it's a habit and you know, habits take time to, to grow, right? It's, not something that happens overnight. It's not a, it's not a switch you can flick, but you know, how you deal with, adversity when you're, you know, in a traffic jam is going to be how you deal with it with your spouse. It's going to be how you deal with it at work. It's going to be how you deal with it in the gym and you know, how you deal with the good times, the bad times, the hard times and you know, how you choose to use your free time, right? If you, if, you do have a busy day at work and you come home and you have those, you know, three to six hours before you go to bed, it's like, you know, it's your choice how to spend those. know, you can have quality time with your family. You can work on a secondary source of income. can work on, you know, something you're passionate about and try to pursue true mastery, whether it's, you know, some sort of arts and crafts, something physical, you know, or even just enjoying time with friends, or you can, you know, stare blankly at a screen and, know, just kind of zone out. and yeah, I think, you know, and I think surrounding yourself with people that are like-minded and if you don't have those people around you, then you can listen to this podcast, right? Or you can listen to, there's a podcast called the high performance podcast that I sometimes listen to from the UK and they have, you know, successful people on there and you know, it's like you can surround yourself with those voices and that can start to propel you towards maybe the kind of success you want to have.

Jaclyn (39:36.607)

That's fabulous advice. Well, I really have enjoyed having you on today. We're really grateful for you spending some time with us at Dutch. And thanks for all the pearls of wisdom that you've shared with everybody today.

Brent Fikowski (39:44.079)

Yeah.

Brent Fikowski (39:48.972)

Yeah, thanks. Hopefully, I didn't ramble on too much. Hopefully, there's something that people can draw from that and I really appreciate that Dutch had me on.

Jaclyn (39:57.805)

Fabulous, well thank you so much.

Brent Fikowski (39:59.352)

Thank you.